Looking like a motor now..

[KendallF]

Thought I'd share a couple of pictures of my progress. :) I am waiting on some AN lines and then the motor and trans can go in.
http://www.secondhandsix.com/images/intake_on%20002.jpg
http://www.secondhandsix.com/images/intake_on%20003.jpg

[EightSecV6]

Your manifold really turned out nice, hope it clears the hood!!! Are you gonna have 2 pipes coming from the intercooler?

[KendallF]

Your manifold really turned out nice, hope it clears the hood!!! Are you gonna have 2 pipes coming from the intercooler? It'll clear...one way or the other. I have a Sawzall, ya know. :arco: Seriously, it's about 1.5" taller than yours, I would guess; it's actually 1" shorter than the 4 bbl/PT&E elbow combo.

I am running two co<Honda>ugh throttle bodies and twin pipes coming from the IC. That'll be the next fun chore; figuring out how to mount the IC, radiator, and where the piping's going to run.

Edit: Forgot to say, thanks for the quick shipping on the gaskets! :)

[turbodave]

Kendall, That thing is, well, beautifull!!!!!!!!!!!

I'll also ask here in case you missed it on the "other board" ;)
A design question if you don't mind?

In looking at your injectors/bungs. Can I ask why you didn't mount the bungs down closer to the end of the runners, and angle them so the injectors would be standing straight up. This, I think, would have had the injectors shooting directly into the head's runner, more in line with air flow.

You know I'm still a rooky at this S2 stuff, so if this is a stupid out of line question, please let me know!

P.S. Think you got enough plenum volume there? ;) ;)

[plowboy72]

holy crap that is badazz. What kinda hp #'s are you looking for? I love it man, congrats. :applaus:

[jmidolo]

Damn, Kendall...that looks very nice. I dont know how you find time to do anything on that though since you're always on line BS'ing :)

Manifold looks sweet tho..did you weld that up??

[KendallF]

holy crap that is badazz. What kinda hp #'s are you looking for? I love it man, congrats.

I just want it to run for starters. It oughta be good for low, low 14s... :sleep:


Damn, Kendall...that looks very nice. I dont know how you find time to do anything on that though since you're always on line BS'ing :)

Manifold looks sweet tho..did you weld that up??

I work on my stuff in the time I save by not buying bling bling stuff for my Beemer... :add_wegbr

I welded some; the pretty stuff on the upper flange and around the inlet tubing was done by my buddy Tracy, the TIG God. All of the sheetmetal, billet flanges, the lid, fuel rail machining, etc. were done by me.

[Reggie West]

:SHOCKED: Your manifold really turned out nice, hope it clears the hood!!! Are you gonna have 2 pipes coming from the intercooler?

That gives a whole new meaning to the term high rise manifold.

You can suck three birds in that intake Kendall. Nice work as usual.

It should be a real monster......

[turbodave231]

Kendall,

I just bought a nice unmolested tunnel ram similiar to yours. A couple questions:

What are you going to do for a thermostat?
What made you decide to use two throttle bodies?
Why did you space the plenum lid up higher?

I am thinking about making a billet lid about 2.5" thick, dowel pinning the lid to the base and milling the face of the manifold flat for a TB mounting pad. I'm doing a single turbo for now.

Dave

[gnsrule]

Hey Kendall, Looks good. If it runs 1/2 as good as it looks you'll be doing allright. Speaking of running, when's the projected date ?? It would be good to debute it at BG, but i just dont think thats gonna happen. Maybe BG '05

Good Luck

[KendallF]

Kendall,

I just bought a nice unmolested tunnel ram similiar to yours. A couple questions:

What are you going to do for a thermostat?
What made you decide to use two throttle bodies?
Why did you space the plenum lid up higher?

I am thinking about making a billet lid about 2.5" thick, dowel pinning the lid to the base and milling the face of the manifold flat for a TB mounting pad. I'm doing a single turbo for now.

Dave

Dave,

I'm going to run braided lines to a remote thermostat housing (already made one). I looked at trying to weld in a crossover and thermostat housing on the manifold; it just looked like it'd be a real pain and since I'm running a distributor and the throttle bodies angle down to keep them under the hood, space was limited.

The throttle bodies were free..that made that decision. :) I also may divide the plenum to try and get some Helmholtz "ram tuning" effect and the twin throttle bodies will allow me to do this. I added the extra plenum volume for the same reason; for the resonant wave effect the plenum volume for each side needs to be 50% of the displacement or better.

All in all, a single throttle body and/or a 4 bbl would've been MUCH simpler. I don't have much money into the intake (about $100) but I have a LOT of time invested. :)


Hey Kendall, Looks good. If it runs 1/2 as good as it looks you'll be doing allright. Speaking of running, when's the projected date ?? It would be good to debute it at BG, but i just dont think thats gonna happen. Maybe BG '05

Good Luck

I am trying to make BG...if I do, it'll be ugly and unpainted at best. We'll see how much time I get. I have to give Scott Simpson a target to make fun of... :frech: :add_wegbr

[turbodave]

Kendall,



What water pump is that you're running? I notice it has a nipple for the small hose. The one that's on the back side of the stock front cover for the "S" hose.

I just recieved my SII front cover and noticed it of course has no provisions for the S hose. But your water pump has a nipple sticking out the top, sort of. Hence my reason for asking.

Do I even need to worry about the S hose (pump to intake)?

[KendallF]

Kendall,



What water pump is that you're running? I notice it has a nipple for the small hose. The one that's on the back side of the stock front cover for the "S" hose.

I just recieved my SII front cover and noticed it of course has no provisions for the S hose. But your water pump has a nipple sticking out the top, sort of. Hence my reason for asking.

Do I even need to worry about the S hose (pump to intake)?

That's a stock replacement water pump..the bypass nipple is on the pump on your stock block, too. :) You could weld in a fitting on the 4 bbl for the bypass, easily enough, or block it on the pump and just drill holes around the thermostat. I think I remember Mac saying that's what he did. I will probably just block mine.

[Nashty]

:marchmell Kendall, that is really nice work. I feel for you, doing stuff from scratch is often lots of work for very little notice of it. The really good fab work often goes un-noticed because it looks manufactured. That's why most of my stuff still has that crappy un-finished look to it! :marchmell

TDave - I turned my intake around backwards. I ground off the bypass on the WP and welded the hole shut. I'll drill some holes in the thermostat. I also plugged the heater return on the back of the cover.

:marchmell

Kendall, you should tap for 4 corner cooling while you're at it. Looks like it would be pretty easy. That way when you're running a long distance race, you will have more even cyl temps. You'll thank me the first enduro race you put your car in.

:marchmell Will hooking up both TB's be a challenge?

Lastly, why a distributor? Now you people have me second guessing. :marchmell

(Marchmell make me laugh, me like marchmell)

[dereklola]

Nashty
What exactly do you mean by "4 corner cooling"?
Derek

[KendallF]

Kendall, you should tap for 4 corner cooling while you're at it. Looks like it would be pretty easy. That way when you're running a long distance race, you will have more even cyl temps. You'll thank me the first enduro race you put your car in.

:marchmell Will hooking up both TB's be a challenge?

Lastly, why a distributor? Now you people have me second guessing. :marchmell

(Marchmell make me laugh, me like marchmell)

Roger, I set it up for 4 corner..I wasn't happy with just the -10s up front, so I have -6s in the back; see the blue fitting in the rear pic above. The throttle body linkage will just be a couple of small rod ends; I don't expect it to be a challenge (though I've been wrong about that before!)

The distributor...I have heard too many stories of woe with the DIS-4, and I wanted a rev limiter and ignition amp. Ken Duttweiler told me it would be worth some HP to ditch the waste spark. He likes the individual coils with the Motec but failing a Lotto win, I'm going to have to stay old school with the MSD 7AL-2 and distributor.


Nashty
What exactly do you mean by "4 corner cooling"?
Derek

Derek, as you probably gathered from my response above, he's talking about running coolant from the back ends of the heads as well as the front. I'm going to run all 4 lines to a surge tank/thermostat mount and from there to the radiator.

[Nashty]

Roger, I set it up for 4 corner..I wasn't happy with just the -10s up front, so I have -6s in the back; see the blue fitting in the rear pic above.

You don't miss any details do you. Are you oiling the valvesprings also?


The distributor...I have heard too many stories of woe with the DIS-4, and I wanted a rev limiter and ignition amp.

Now you went and pissed on my happy ignition parade. I wasn't even worried about that. Now I's gots ta start ta worryn'

I'm hoping my DIS will work ok with the MSD box and the Big Stuff ECU. Seems the FAST was the culprit earlier (or part of the problem anyway).

Please do not paint your car. I know that mine won't be looking to good, it will probably have some rust, dings, dents... It is a Metro after all, judged by Metro standards, IT'S A GEM !!! :goldcup:

I think most people will be less interested in my car than the pit bike anyway. :marchmell

[turbodave]

That's a stock replacement water pump..the bypass nipple is on the pump on your stock block, too. :) You could weld in a fitting on the 4 bbl for the bypass, easily enough, or block it on the pump and just drill holes around the thermostat. I think I remember Mac saying that's what he did. I will probably just block mine.

OK, I see now. I just went out and pulled the covers off my 86, and the nipple on the water pump is actually connected to the heater hose assembly (heater supply/return) (plus the other one on the intake, heater supply/return). The S hose is connected to that nipple on the back of the front cover, and goes to the manifold (some type of bypass I assume). Now, what I've noticed is on the SII front cover there's a rather large threaded hole in exactly the spot where that nipple is on the stock front cover. In looking closely at your pictures I can see where the water pump covers that hole, but I assume to feed water to it, the front cover would have to be "channeled out" similar to the stock cover.

I guess I'm wondering how important that S hose is to the overall scheme of things. Probably not, huh?

[Mac in SD]

Re: bypass, or "s" hose, yeah you probably should have some sort of bypass to prevent cavitation/hot spots while the stat is closed. I originally just blocked off the bypass nipple on the front cover and drilled some holes in the thermostat flange. BUT I probably overdid it on the size of the holes (4 x 1/8" holes) and the motor took forever to warm up. So I ditched that and tapped the water bridge on the manifold and am now using the "s" hose setup. Actually, there's plenty of metal to just tap it for a pipe thread fitting - no welding required (just don't go too deep with the pipe-thread tap.) Keep in mind that an S2 block with S2 heads is a relatively cool-running motor (Ruggles' book said so, and I found out it's true.) OTOH, Dave, I'm not familiar with the coolant passages or characteristics of your aluminum blocks.

[turbodave]

Re: bypass, or "s" hose, yeah you probably should have some sort of bypass to prevent cavitation/hot spots while the stat is closed. I originally just blocked off the bypass nipple on the front cover and drilled some holes in the thermostat flange. BUT I probably overdid it on the size of the holes (4 x 1/8" holes) and the motor took forever to warm up. So I ditched that and tapped the water bridge on the manifold and am now using the "s" hose setup. Actually, there's plenty of metal to just tap it for a pipe thread fitting - no welding required (just don't go too deep with the pipe-thread tap.) Keep in mind that an S2 block with S2 heads is a relatively cool-running motor (Ruggles' book said so, and I found out it's true.) OTOH, Dave, I'm not familiar with the coolant passages or characteristics of your aluminum blocks.
So far, the only differences in the internal cooling seems to be somewhat minor. Each bank of cylinders on the block has 6 holes, the one lower on each end, and the two uppers between the second and third cylinders. There are no slots on each end of the cylinder banks, and because of the the incredibly thick cylinder walls, they're siamesed and there doesn't seem to be any room to add steam vents between the cylinders (there's non there).
Here's a good view of what I mean: